greywire
Posts: 37
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| Posted: 07/31/2007, 1:02 PM |
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The biggest issues I have with codecharge are where I need to do things that don't fit in with the standard way the CCS works, which in all fairness is maybe 20% of my projects.
So here goes:
I want the generated classes to be more modular. Yes you can include one page into another, but that's it. What if I want to have multiple instances of a grid on one page? What if I want to make each one slightly different?
What if one record is updated, and it needs to insert or update to another record? I want to be able to call that other class and use it to insert a record. Right now, all the generated classes assume they are working only through an HTML form.
CCS seems to use a roughtly MVC structure (the Controler and View are in one class, and Model in another) , but the classes are tightly bound such that you cannot use them separately or subclass them. IE, What if I want to use the Model (cls*DataSource) to do CRUD operations directly, not by using the HTML FORM? This is important for, say, AJAX operations, or the above example of one update operation causing another insert. Yes, you can just put in the raw SQL to do the second insert, but then you are working around CCS's already generated class for that table.
I would like to see the Model, View and Controler broken out as three distinct classes. I would like to be able to subclass them as needed to change behavior. Maybe I don't want my model to go directly to a table, but to something else... maybe send the data somewhere remote, or save to a file, or whatever. Maybe I want my view to format the data as JSON data in addition to HTML. Maybe I want the controler to trigger a record insert on another table, by using a model class created elsewhere by ccs.
I think I saw somewhere that somebody suggested CCS as an ORM tool. But its not. Nor do I want an ORM tool. ORM is evil. CCS creates CRUD classes and it seems like with just a little more flexibility built into it, you could use those to create both a simple page oriented application or a complex object oriented, structured application that uses those CRUD classes as the backend to a rich AJAX front end (the front end being left to the developer to use whatever he/she likes, be it prototype or ext or whatever).
I'm at the point where major parts of my application either need this ability in CCS or they will have to be rewritten for a framework (leaning towards Kohana PHP). But then I will miss the easy building of CRUD pages where that's all I need (80% of the app), because CCS is a visual design tool as well as code generataor.
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Aric Caley
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mikehoskins
Posts: 17
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| Posted: 09/10/2007, 1:18 PM |
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Why is ORM evil? Have the frameworks that implemented ORM, in your experience, been evil, instead?
Other than "ORM is evil," everything you've said in your email has Ruby on Rails written all over it. Obviously, there is no "one solution" for any web problem, but MVC is inherent in RoR.
It takes some getting used to, and scalability is more difficult, but RoR sounds like what the doctor ordered.
That is, if you don't think ActiveRecord / ORM in RoR is still evil.
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greywire
Posts: 37
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| Posted: 09/13/2007, 12:17 PM |
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Quote mikehoskins:
Why is ORM evil? Have the frameworks that implemented ORM, in your experience, been evil, instead?
Other than "ORM is evil," everything you've said in your email has Ruby on Rails written all over it. Obviously, there is no "one solution" for any web problem, but MVC is inherent in RoR.
It takes some getting used to, and scalability is more difficult, but RoR sounds like what the doctor ordered.
That is, if you don't think ActiveRecord / ORM in RoR is still evil.
But I don't want Ruby on Rails. I want PHP and Codecharge. That's why I am posting here with wishes for functionality in codecharge. I want my visual design tool that lets me generate code based on my input.
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Aric Caley
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mikehoskins
Posts: 17
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| Posted: 09/16/2007, 5:57 AM |
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I can understand sticking to a language/framework that you are familiar with.
Still, why is ORM considered evil?
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greywire
Posts: 37
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| Posted: 09/17/2007, 10:39 AM |
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Quote mikehoskins:
I can understand sticking to a language/framework that you are familiar with.
Still, why is ORM considered evil?
Its a long article, but very interesting: http://blogs.tedneward.com/2006/06/26/The+Vietnam+Of+Computer+Science.aspx
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Aric Caley
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